View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently Mon Nov 18, 2019 3:00 pm



Reply to topic  [ 49 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
MGS2 Cutscene analysis 
Author Message
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 2:14 pm
Posts: 36
Reply with quote
Post MGS2 Cutscene analysis
Maybe you guys can help me with this...

I know it's been a WHILE, but this has been bugging me since I first beat the game so many years ago. I think the final cutscene on Arsenal Gear was censored...I don't see how Gear can just show up in downtown Manhattan (Very close to ground Zero, by the way, you can tell by the statue of GW). with no footage of the crash/landing. Perhaps Konami didn't want to offend anyone? I can understand that they'd want to avoid that sort of backlash, but if so, why not release the full scene with Substance? I'd like to ask someone of authority if what I think is true. What do you guys think?

GcD


Wed Oct 13, 2004 2:22 pm
Profile
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 06, 2004 11:33 am
Posts: 2917
Location: Mexico
Reply with quote
Post 
Well, it was official taht it was censored/changed by 9/11. Pics of the original scene can be found at:

http://junkerhq.net/MetalGear/makingbookimages.html

(Click on New York (Removed Scene))

For info on the original scene, read the script in the Document of Metal Gear Solid.

I think that it was never shown again due to two reasons..

1) Not to alter the original game (that was released)
2) Work in MGS3 (and not having to redo the stuff)
3) Respect

_________________
From the mathematical perspective, consciousness might be regarded as a second derivative of sensation.
-- Terrel Miedaner

[Junker HQ]


Wed Oct 13, 2004 2:26 pm
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 2:14 pm
Posts: 36
Reply with quote
Post 
No kidding!? I had no idea...What is the "Document"? Is that a separate disk or a book?
Any idea on where I'd find it?


Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:14 pm
Profile
Major
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 6:01 am
Posts: 573
Location: Busted Kiddy Pool In The Front Yard
Reply with quote
Post 
9-11 took out alot of good ideas, yet they didn't have to, not saying I hate 9-11 cause this :shock: . I wanted to see snake escape an exploding tanker. :x I yet to wonder if that wasn't just taken out, but removed cause of space and production problems.

_________________
Image


Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:35 pm
Profile ICQ YIM WWW
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 06, 2004 11:33 am
Posts: 2917
Location: Mexico
Reply with quote
Post 
Snake Plissken wrote:
I wanted to see snake escape an exploding tanker. :x I yet to wonder if that wasn't just taken out, but removed cause of space and production problems.


That was taken out because Kojima though it was no fun to play, just sheer eye candy. He states it in the euro release extras disc I believe....

GcDiaz wrote:
What is the "Document"? Is that a separate disk or a book?
Any idea on where I'd find it?


A separate disc, scans are here:

Document of MGS2

Depending on where you live, a shop may be an option, an online shop or ebay....

_________________
From the mathematical perspective, consciousness might be regarded as a second derivative of sensation.
-- Terrel Miedaner

[Junker HQ]


Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:54 pm
Profile WWW
J.U.N.K.E.R.
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 3:31 pm
Posts: 299
Location: North Carolina
Reply with quote
Post 
I saw a copy at EB Games, Ill definatly be sure to pic it up next time I see that baby 8)

_________________
Image


Wed Oct 13, 2004 4:14 pm
Profile YIM WWW
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 06, 2004 5:53 pm
Posts: 51
Reply with quote
Post 
Snake Plissken wrote:
9-11 took out alot of good ideas, yet they didn't have to, not saying I hate 9-11 cause this :shock: . I wanted to see snake escape an exploding tanker. :x I yet to wonder if that wasn't just taken out, but removed cause of space and production problems.


I thought I read somewhere that the sinking tanker sequence had been taken out due to the technical limitations of the PS2's hardware--they couldn't get it to meet Kojima's original expectations.


Wed Oct 13, 2004 4:21 pm
Profile
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 2:14 pm
Posts: 36
Reply with quote
Post 
Found it for 9 bucks on Ebay, should be arriving soon.


Wed Oct 13, 2004 4:46 pm
Profile
General

Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 2:46 am
Posts: 3379
Reply with quote
Post 
Tao wrote:
Snake Plissken wrote:
9-11 took out alot of good ideas, yet they didn't have to, not saying I hate 9-11 cause this :shock: . I wanted to see snake escape an exploding tanker. :x I yet to wonder if that wasn't just taken out, but removed cause of space and production problems.


I thought I read somewhere that the sinking tanker sequence had been taken out due to the technical limitations of the PS2's hardware--they couldn't get it to meet Kojima's original expectations.


He also said he wanted snipers manning searchlights, but it was too much on the hardware. Dunno where this would have fit into the game anyway, though, since the Plant is set during the day. And the Tanker, well the only place they would have been really is at the rear where the game starts. Seems rather sudden to me, to put it in a place like that.


Thu Oct 14, 2004 3:06 am
Profile
Second Lieutenant
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 4:34 pm
Posts: 399
Location: Old L.A.
Reply with quote
Post 
You're absolutely right Artemio, Kojima-san does say on the European Bonus DVD that he removed the Snake escaping the tanker scene because it was no fun to play, just holding directions.

Also, isn't the suspense of Snake's survival held better if we don't actually see/play him escaping from the tanker?

_________________
"But nothing is permanent... only change"


Last edited by Jonathan Ingram on Thu Oct 14, 2004 8:36 am, edited 1 time in total.



Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:03 am
Profile WWW
Major
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 6:01 am
Posts: 573
Location: Busted Kiddy Pool In The Front Yard
Reply with quote
Post 
if I find time I'll give my document a good look, its been a while.

_________________
Image


Thu Oct 14, 2004 5:09 am
Profile ICQ YIM WWW
User avatar

Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2004 8:51 am
Posts: 6
Location: Netsphere
Reply with quote
Post 
It were the Patriots who take that cutscene off the game(just kidding) :P

_________________
Image


Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:05 am
Profile WWW
J.U.N.K.E.R.
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 3:31 pm
Posts: 299
Location: North Carolina
Reply with quote
Post 
Well look at this:

"Rumor #3: Someone is making a video game that will feature the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks.

Source: The developer of the game, Germany-based Replay Studios.

The official story: GameSpot could not reach Replay officials for comment.

What we heard: When posts with headlines such as "9/11: The Game" started popping up on various forums, many thought the game would an offensive creation by terrorist sympathizers, similar to the (unfortunately) abundant suicide-bomber flash games. Like most things in life, however, the reality was much more complex. According to Replay, the game, entitled Survivor, "is a third-person disaster survival game with highly interactive locations, based on famous, authentic-historical disaster scenarios." This will not only include the horrors of Sept. 11, but also the 1985 Mexico City earthquake, the 1945 Hiroshima bombing, and the sinking of the Titanic. Why would anyone want to experience any of these hellish events? "We call this unique genre 'reality gaming,'" goes Replay's sales pitch. "[This] highly original single-player game concept has never been seen before." Incidentally, the highly original single-player game has not yet found a publisher.

Bogus or not bogus?: Not bogus. "

That is a total outrage, with the 9/11 attacks being in there. I could understand the Earthquake and Hurricanes seeing as they are natural disasters, but the 9/11 were caused out of hatred and this should never be put into any form of entertainment, at least not now because it happened so close to this time. :evil:

_________________
Image


Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:34 am
Profile YIM WWW
Second Lieutenant
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 4:34 pm
Posts: 399
Location: Old L.A.
Reply with quote
Post 
I think that that idea for a game is an outrage, as you put it, but not only because of the 11/9 attacks. Don't you think that the people who died in the Mexico earthquake, or Hiroshima would be upset too? Hiroshima certainly wasn't a natural disaster. And I can't help but think it a little hypocritical to say that 'these hellish events' should not be put into 'any form of entertainment' when millions of gamers will happily hack up other characters in GTA with a chainsaw, or shoot other soldiers in MGS.

_________________
"But nothing is permanent... only change"


Sat Oct 16, 2004 11:51 am
Profile WWW
Major
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:34 pm
Posts: 547
Reply with quote
Post 
I heard rumors that the cut-scene of Arsenal Gear crashing into Manhattan was put in the Japanese version of Substance as a hidden feature for completing all five Snake Tales. Anyone cares to verify this?


Sat Oct 16, 2004 5:32 pm
Profile
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 2:14 pm
Posts: 36
Reply with quote
Post 
Substance has been out long enough that the secret would be out, if it the reumor was true....

I never did get how MGS2 chars could say "la-li-lu-le-lo" with a straight face. I find it extremely jarring, especially after getting so involved in this "realistic" stealth-action thriller. At least the "infinite ammo" bandanna could be seen as an inside joke.


Sat Oct 16, 2004 5:47 pm
Profile
J.U.N.K.E.R.
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 3:31 pm
Posts: 299
Location: North Carolina
Reply with quote
Post 
Jonathan Ingram wrote:
I think that that idea for a game is an outrage, as you put it, but not only because of the 11/9 attacks. Don't you think that the people who died in the Mexico earthquake, or Hiroshima would be upset too? Hiroshima certainly wasn't a natural disaster. And I can't help but think it a little hypocritical to say that 'these hellish events' should not be put into 'any form of entertainment' when millions of gamers will happily hack up other characters in GTA with a chainsaw, or shoot other soldiers in MGS.


Well I mean, there was nothing true that touched millions of people ever put into GTA, and if so, they dont come out and say "HEY LOOK!" so they can create a controversy to increase sales.

_________________
Image


Sat Oct 16, 2004 6:04 pm
Profile YIM WWW
Major
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 6:01 am
Posts: 573
Location: Busted Kiddy Pool In The Front Yard
Reply with quote
Post 
I could have sworn I read somewhere that the bandana thing was between Kojima san and Tomokazu Fukushima. It has an ethical meaning and inside joke to past konami games and crappy rpgs.

_________________
Image


Sat Oct 16, 2004 6:36 pm
Profile ICQ YIM WWW
Major
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:34 pm
Posts: 547
Reply with quote
Post 
GcDiaz wrote:
Substance has been out long enough that the secret would be out, if it the reumor was true....


Yeah, but this was a feature from the Japanese version that was taken out from the localized versions. (as in not featured in the US version). :p

Besides, some games tend to have little-known secrets that the average player don't find out until years after its release.

Quote:
I could have sworn I read somewhere that the bandana thing was between Kojima san and Tomokazu Fukushima. It has an ethical meaning and inside joke to past konami games and crappy rpgs.


I always thought it was a Policenauts reference, what with the fact that Meryl wore a bandanna in Policenauts. Then again, I don't remember Meryl's bandanna having infinite written over it.


Sat Oct 16, 2004 7:41 pm
Profile
General

Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 2:46 am
Posts: 3379
Reply with quote
Post 
I might get the JP Substance sometime, so I could check it out. But the voices are in English and not Japanese, so I'm less motivated to do so. Maybe a site would have this info somewhere.


Sat Oct 16, 2004 8:39 pm
Profile
Runner
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 5:06 am
Posts: 190
Location: Suomi, ulkomaanpellet!
Reply with quote
Post 
Ninja Kurosai wrote:
Jonathan Ingram wrote:
I think that that idea for a game is an outrage, as you put it, but not only because of the 11/9 attacks. Don't you think that the people who died in the Mexico earthquake, or Hiroshima would be upset too? Hiroshima certainly wasn't a natural disaster. And I can't help but think it a little hypocritical to say that 'these hellish events' should not be put into 'any form of entertainment' when millions of gamers will happily hack up other characters in GTA with a chainsaw, or shoot other soldiers in MGS.


Well I mean, there was nothing true that touched millions of people ever put into GTA, and if so, they dont come out and say "HEY LOOK!" so they can create a controversy to increase sales.


This is a tricky thing. We have plenty of entertainment made from the second World War and Vietnam war, for example, and I don't think anybody would seriously say that 9/11 was worse than WW2. 9/11 is simply such a touchy subject because of the closeness. It was a huge emotional impact, and the problem is that you can't really fight emotion with logic. I personally can see some idea behind the 'Survivor' game. Such disasters are not only grief for the victims and those close to them, but great triumphs to those who manage to survive them (note the title).


Sat Oct 16, 2004 8:51 pm
Profile
J.U.N.K.E.R.
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 3:31 pm
Posts: 299
Location: North Carolina
Reply with quote
Post 
You explained what I was hinting at :)

_________________
Image


Sat Oct 16, 2004 9:03 pm
Profile YIM WWW
Major
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:34 pm
Posts: 547
Reply with quote
Post 
Osiris wrote:
I might get the JP Substance sometime, so I could check it out. But the voices are in English and not Japanese, so I'm less motivated to do so. Maybe a site would have this info somewhere.


Yeah. I tried that and search for any urawaza page in Japanese to see if they had such a secret listed, but no such luck.

I've seen someone on a forum claimed that it's possible, but then again, it was a forum after all.


Sat Oct 16, 2004 9:08 pm
Profile
General

Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 2:46 am
Posts: 3379
Reply with quote
Post 
Johnny Undaunted wrote:
Osiris wrote:
I might get the JP Substance sometime, so I could check it out. But the voices are in English and not Japanese, so I'm less motivated to do so. Maybe a site would have this info somewhere.


Yeah. I tried that and search for any urawaza page in Japanese to see if they had such a secret listed, but no such luck.

I've seen someone on a forum claimed that it's possible, but then again, it was a forum after all.


Was this is an English or Japanese forum?


Sat Oct 16, 2004 9:19 pm
Profile
Major
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 7:34 pm
Posts: 547
Reply with quote
Post 
Osiris wrote:
Johnny Undaunted wrote:
Osiris wrote:
I might get the JP Substance sometime, so I could check it out. But the voices are in English and not Japanese, so I'm less motivated to do so. Maybe a site would have this info somewhere.


Yeah. I tried that and search for any urawaza page in Japanese to see if they had such a secret listed, but no such luck.

I've seen someone on a forum claimed that it's possible, but then again, it was a forum after all.


Was this is an English or Japanese forum?


Well, to be honest, it was GameFAQs of all place. The poster said it was just a pre-production demo with no sound (like the ones in Document). Make that what you will.


Sat Oct 16, 2004 9:58 pm
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 49 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by ST Software for PTF.