Suikoden

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Suikoden

Post by Junker Gear Snatcher »

I'm curious, anyone else on here ever play any of the Genso Suikoden/Suikoden games?

Edit: I slashed the title, because Suikoden is it's English title, but the first game was called Genso Suikoden even in English.
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Re: Suikoden

Post by Commander_AK-47 »

Never played them, I'm willing to try any Konami game though.
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Re: Suikoden

Post by Junker Gear Snatcher »

The thing I love most about Suikoden is they really try to create a story with a very strong sense of friendship. They also incorporate a variety of people and personalities.

A general run-down is that Suikoden is a series that includes (so far) numbers 1-5, Suikoden Tactics, and two Japanese only text adventures called Suikogaiden. It (generally) features 6-man parties, turn based combat, large-scale war battles (fought like a dubbed down version of an RTS that works off a "rock, paper, scissors" form of combat. Each Suikoden (while using a character recruitment guide) has given me, on average, 60+ hours of playtime. It also has various mini-games, at least one form of gambling, and a compelling storyline.

Suikoden however began a transitional phase with numbers III and IV, and I strongly suggest that if you've played those, to play numbers I, II and V instead. V is a good representative of the series. And from the impressions I got from the project leaders, they're going to rely on V's system for future installments.

The game's history is very in-depth, however the games have different scenarios, protagonists, and even home countries, so you don't really need to play the entire series, but I can guarantee that if you like one, you won't stop there.
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Re: Suikoden

Post by JimboKudo »

I borrowed Suikoden 2 from a friend a while ago, and I think I spent quite a while playing through that (40 hours I think). Unfortunately, I didn't gain enough characters fast enough to get the "good" plot twist near the end of the game, but I still had fun playing it. After I beat that game I looked up the third game on youtube, and that game has the coolest intro I've ever seen in any videogame (my opinion).

I've heard from various sources that the third one is the best, but when I talk to other fans, they seem to generally like the first or second one the best. Anyway, I'm glad my friend let me borrow it, because it costs a lot on ebay for the second game.

I'm not sure whether it's us american's trying to keep the game collectible, or what, but the japanese got BOTH of the games on one UMD for the psp. I was dissapointed to find that there was no American/European release.
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Re: Suikoden

Post by Junker Gear Snatcher »

JimboKudo wrote:After I beat that game I looked up the third game on youtube, and that game has the coolest intro I've ever seen in any videogame (my opinion).
Yes! The anime intro to III is superb!

JimboKudo wrote:I've heard from various sources that the third one is the best, but when I talk to other fans, they seem to generally like the first or second one the best.
That's all a matter of preference, the third game IS good, but the third game takes a very different approach, rather than one main character, you have three, and the 108 stapled characters get divided up. There are many reasons why III is held in high regard, but from someone such as myself that has played the entire series, there are also reasons why I or II are better.

This is purely my opinion, but 1 isn't and can not be the "best" it was very buggy, the presentation wasn't great and I wouldn't recommend it to anyone except on the basis that it's the first one and an... essential introduction to a GREAT series. II, in my opinion took everything about 1 and made it better, unfortunately the storylines between the two and since 60% of II's 108 characters are returning characters for 1, I would not recommend II to anyone without playing the first one first.

Many "fans" lost faith in the series after the release of Suikoden IV and Suikoden Tactics. IV's... not very well liked, it's VERY detached from the series and is more like a spin-off. Tactics is a sequel to IV and in my opinion it's a better game, but still...

Suikoden V... I have NO idea what the "general consensus" is there, but in my opinion it is a return to the original engine, and has ALL the greatness of the .. well... series, really. It plays like I and II, It's got the graphical appeal of III, and IV DID have the best sound effects and sound quality.
JimboKudo wrote:I'm not sure whether it's us american's trying to keep the game collectible, or what, but the japanese got BOTH of the games on one UMD for the psp. I was dissapointed to find that there was no American/European release.
I was QUITE upset when that UMD was not released in this region. I pride myself on my honesty, so I won't lie: I do not own a legit copy of II, I have everything except II and III. But both of them are quite rare. I'd gladly buy both at the CURRENT new release price, but I refuse to spend like 150 dollars on a game. It is a good game, but that's... absurd. The pricing seems to be going down, from what I can tell on eBay, but a few years back, you couldn't find it for any less than 200 dollars.

But yeah, I'd gladly buy the UMD. I toyed with the idea of getting it in Japanese, since I know the game so well, but unfortunately certain characters have to be recruited randomly, and it requires you to get certain responses.. and that could be difficult...

My opinion however is: Can't afford or find II? V is JUST as great, the storyline is connected, yet not so much that you need the other games to understand. In fact, V comes marginally before I in the timeline
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Re: Suikoden

Post by JimboKudo »

Maybe I should play V next then. I just wish these games were easier to find.

About pirating, I've said this before on this forum, but that was a while ago. I don't know if you've ever heard of the Home of the Underdogs, but they're an abandonware website that hosts downloads for a ton of old games that the companies don't care about anymore. In my opinion, that type of website is great. They help introduce the classic videogames to many people who never had a chance to play them, and, at the same time, keep sections for old games that the companies DO care about and won't offer downloads for them.

If the company and team are no longer making money off of a game, at all. Then downloading old games isn't stealing anybody's bread and butter. I don't agree with the people who aren't willing to buy a game when it comes out. In my opinion, pirating those games is stealing DIRECTLY from the company and their employees. Recently, there's been a lot of piracy surrounding the psp, which is sad I think. Pirating new games drops sales, making it harder for a small company to release more games.

If somebody downloads an old game like Suikoden, then I have nothing against that at all. I myself, am a bit of a collector, so I'd rather buy the real game, even if it IS expensive. But most people aren't collectors.

Anyway, that's my rant.
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Re: Suikoden

Post by Junker Gear Snatcher »

Couldn't agree more.

I own a PSP, and the only thing I did was download a emulator, only to play an old computer game called Monkey Island, which I own two copies of, well of that one game, I bought the entire series. But you can't buy it for the PSP and it'd be a great game for travelling. In the end I decided that having the lastest firmware was a better pay off.

The PSP is a great system, I own a DS as well, but I play my PSP more, it's larger and I find the DS is a bit more uncomfortable.

As for abandonware, most of those games are old, or were released by companies that went under. (Shame we'll never get any new Battletoads games.) I own games like Syndicate, Railway Tycoon, Pirates, Colonization, Cannon Fodder. Most of those games you bought from flea markets for pocket change, they'd come in plastic bags and with pieces of paper or an extra disc labeled "security system passwords" Instead of todays copyright protocols, you had codes in either the manual or with the manual to input every boot-up to verify that you bought the game. It was never really considered a big deal.

Nowadays it's a strip of paper you can only input once, the discs HAVE to be inserted in order to run, and even then you could still wind up with a stolen authorization key or a corrupt disc. As far as that's concerned, we've taken a step backwards, I find.

Edit: And hot seat gameplay, that's not done anymore.
LOL, since you only needed the discs to install, I know we used to swap games with all kinds of our close friends, and we'd be playing the same game, they were all boughten copies but that's just the way things were done.
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Re: Suikoden

Post by JimboKudo »

I also have a few different emulators for my psp. I just like the idea of playing Super Metroid and Lufia on the go. I'm also playing a few of the original castlevania games for the nes as well. The thing about emulators is that they are generally for older systems anyway.

The thing about system passwords for newer games is that there are always illegal patches to bypass those anyway. In the end, if people want to pirate, they WILL pirate.

I do miss hot seat gameplay. I love playing games like Chaos Overlords with a few friends, but nowadays you need two computers with two games. Everyone always hated having to have two Tetris gameboy cartridges just to play multiplayer. They need to use hot seat more nowadays. Then again, it wouldn't be any good if the developer just slopped something together either. And it's understandable that some games can't have it.

Slightly back to topic, I'm probably going to buy FF7 for 40 bucks from a friend, and then the next RPG that I'm gonna buy will probably Suikoden III. I've just gotta play the rest of the games. I have this creeping feeling that the Suikoden games are gonna be more fun than FF7. I think that FF7 is heavily over-hyped (I haven't played it yet though). One of my favorite things about Suikoden II is the leveling system. It's made so that characters are able to quickly catch up to other characters' levels.

Sorry if any of this didn't make good english, I'm really tired right now.
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Re: Suikoden

Post by Letiumtide »

I personally love the Suikoden series, though I didn't much care for III/IV/tactics, so I guess you could say I love half the series. I really tried to love III too, but I just couldn't get into it.

That said, I've been dying to hear of a Suikoden VI release for ages, I know Konami knows that there is a niche market out there for Suikoden, hell looking at the ebay sale prices of Suikoden II should have been enough for them to release I & II for the PSP here, but nooo...

Rumours keep popping up about another game but they seem to disappear just as fast, pity, it's one of the better long running RPG series thus far.
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Re: Suikoden

Post by JimboKudo »

In some ways I like it WAY more than the newer FF games that have been coming out. When I play Suikoden, at least I can be sure that my main character isn't just pretending to like girls. FF X and FF XII.......that's different.

I really think that they haven't released the psp version is because the collector's out there might end up pissed if they ever wanted to sell their psx copies.
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Re: Suikoden

Post by Letiumtide »

http://www.gamekyo.com/news28495_le-pro ... roche.html

Poor Babelfish Translation:
Le prochain Suikoden en approche ? The next Suikoden approach? [rumor]

La rumeur d'un prochain Suikoden enfle au fur et à mesure des semaines et c'est cette fois l'USPTO qui se permet de lister un certain Suikoden Tierkreis . The rumour of an upcoming Suikoden swells as the weeks and this time the USPTO which is to list some Suikoden Tierkreis. On attendra la confirmation de Konami en laissant les fans deviner pour le moment la plate-forme qui aura droit à ce probable futur bijou. We await confirmation of Konami leaving fans guessing for the moment the platform that will be entitled to the probable future jewel. PlayStation 3 comme le veut la tradition ? PlayStation 3 as is the tradition? Xbox 360 qui choppe les grosses exclus du RPG en ce moment ? Xbox 360 which choppe large excluded from the RPG at the moment? Ou encore la Wii qui n'a pour le moment pas obtenu de titres AAA de la part de Konami ? Or the Wii which has not yet received no AAA titles from Konami?
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Re: Suikoden

Post by Synthoid »

While I'm not too keen on the RPG genre nowadays, I'm rather fond of the Suikoden series. I think they're vastly superior to anything that Square-Enix have ever brought out, and that especially includes the Final Fantasy series, which in later years has gotten progressively worse and played a large role in my eventual distaste with the genre. Final Fantasy has become cliche, and superficial. Style over substance. Just look at the trailers for the upcoming Final Fantasy XIII, or XIII Versus. Young bishounen protagonists with ridiculous powers, brooding and angsting over trivial nonsense. Suikoden, on the other hand, has much more enriching stories and characters with plenty of depth.
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Re: Suikoden

Post by Junker Gear Snatcher »

Yes, Suikoden did stutter step a bit with Suikoden's III, IV, and Tactics.

It's funny, for me, I like Tactics more than IV, but Tactics made me appreciate the main character from IV (who returns) over the main character from Tactics, and in IV I couldn't STAND Lazlo.

Suikoden V however proves to me, that the gaming industry is NOT going downhill, and neither is the RPG genre. It's a must have for:

Suikoden Fans
OR
More standard RPG fans

Kinda like how Dragon Quest is for a more Older genre of RPGs..

Suikoden VI will be excellent. I followed the creation of Suikoden V very closely and it was built with this question in mind:

"What makes a REAL Suikoden game?" Suikoden V is the answer, it's a cold hard look at the series in the mirror and the dev team is quite pleased. no doubt Suikoden V's style (closely reminiscent to Suikoden I and II) will be the series staple from here on out.

However a lot of people online are calling out for the series to "wrap up the loose ends" I STRONGLY disagree, I'm not sure about you, but trailing the loose ends a bit more is NOT a bad thing.

I do NOT want this series to suffer from Comic Book Movie syndrome, don't cut you feet out from under you if you plan on sequels. It's easier with this series to make a new country, new characters and kinda move forward with the series overview storyline... then to jump ahead, wrap up and then pick out gaps and holes.
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Re: Suikoden

Post by jcgamer60 »

I played the first game; wasn't bad. I think I lost interest near the end. Everyone says the 2nd game is the best so I might give that one a try one day.
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Re: Suikoden

Post by Junker Gear Snatcher »

Yeah, in retrospect, you NEED the first game to truly understand the second.. but the first game... isn't great.. I began to get bored around Neclord in Suikoden I, it just loses it's edge a little.

The second game though is a completely different story, due to the various choices you can make, I played the game three times back to back, each playthrough resulting in a different storyline flow and ending, and each accumulating 60 hours of gameplay.

You might not be an enthused as I was but it does offer a very memorable experience.
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Re: Suikoden

Post by Letiumtide »

Well, I'm sure everybody here has heard by now but the next Suikoden game is going to be on the DS.

They seem to be following IV's 4 man party.


- 50% complete
- Characters are 3d
- Backgrounds 2d
- Traditional rpg it looks like
- You tap the touch screen, making battles move at a fast pace
- The main headline of the article is "The Chosen 108 heroes have been destroyed?!" so maybe this game will be different from other Suikoden games in that regard?

http://www.atlus.com/new_forum/viewtopi ... 2620#62620 - Scans
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Re: Suikoden

Post by Junker Gear Snatcher »

Nice find, Letiumtide.

I hadn't heard about this at all. I REALLY appreciate this news.

Looks to me like the character designs, and the anime sequences are going to be done by the same folks that handled Suikoden III's characters and anime intro.

However this isn't the next mainstream Suikoden, this is a spin-off, I know this because the name Tier-something, was trademarked not too long ago. Suikoden VI is still evading the radar.

Who knows what system Suikoden VI will go to... the others have been on the playstations, except for Suikoden Card Stories, which was the Gameboy Advance.

Just because this is going to a Nintendo system, doesn't mean the series will jump to Nintendo.. however Konami figures the Suikoden crowd have not jumped unto the PS3 bandwagon... So whatever decision that make will wind up as "the lesser of two evils."
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