Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

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Which version do you perfer?

PlayStation Version
4
44%
Sega Saturn Version
5
56%
 
Total votes: 9

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GirianSeed573
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(SAT) Snatcher
(SAT) Policenauts
(PS1) Metal Gear Solid (Digital, PSN)
(PS1) Metal Gear Solid: VR Missions
(GBC) Metal Gear Solid (cartridge-only)
(PS2) Zone of the Enders
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty
(PS2) The Document of Metal Gear Solid 2
(PS2) Zone of the Enders: The 2nd Runner
(GBA) boktai: The Sun is in Your Hand
(NGC) Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater
(PSP) Metal Gear AC!D (UMD-only)
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Digital Graphic Novel (Digital, PSN)
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops Plus
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid: The Essential Collection
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid 4: Database
(iOS) Metal Gear Solid: Touch
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection Limited Edition
(360) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection
(3DS) Metal Gear Solid: Snake Eater 3D
(PSV) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection
(PS3) Zone of the Enders HD Collection
(360) Zone of the Enders HD Collection Limited Edition
(PS3) Zone of the Enders HD Edition (JP, Digital, PSN)
(PS3) Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance Limited Edition
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid: The Legacy Collection (NA & JP)
(Win) Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes (NA & JP)
(360) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes (Digital, Xbox Live)
(Win) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain
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Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by GirianSeed573 »

Okay, I just wanted to run down most of the differrnces between the two 32-bit versions of Snatcher;
Then I'll let you vote on which one you would prefer.

PlayStation

PlayStation Version's Pros
1. Mouse Support - Used for selecting options in the normal menu and Shooting Scenes.
2. Light Gun Support - But only for the short-lived Konami Hyper Blaster.
3. Extra Options - Accessed through hidden menu. (UUDDLRLRXO) Can select Act 1~3 Background Wallpaper, Cursor Color, and Target Pointer.
4. Extra Sprite Animation - Compared to the Saturn version, there are extra animations including: Metal moving his head more, Differnt Wallpaper animations for each Act, etc.
5. Better Quality Audio - Compared to the SS version the BGM has better sounding samples and the Music flows more smoothly. XA Audio has better quality than the Sega Saturn version's AIF & ADPCM. All sounds have a higher sample rate. One track has also been omitted for the Saturn version as well.
6. Smoother Controls - Speaks for itself.

PlayStation Version's Cons
1. Censorship - Nudity is Concealed. Some scenes Gore is shown briefly before being covered by a Mosaic or Blackened out.
2. Dialogue doesn't seem to flow as smoothly as the Saturn version and takes unnecessarily long pauses.

Sega Saturn Version

Saturn Version's Pros
1. Easiest to Procure - The least rare version of the Game and is the most affordable.
2. Smooth Flowing Dialogue - Some pauses between lines have been shortened and some animation has been altered to flow more smoothly.
3. Uncensored - Lacks the PlayStation's censoring. Some nudity has seemingly been added! Gore is also uncensored, but the Death of Alice remains concealed.
4. Included Extras - This version includes a Set of Stickers along with the rest of the material included with the Game. This may have been compensation for the late release (One month after the PS version).

Saturn Version's Cons
1. Lacks the Extra Options of PS1 Release - No Excuse except for possibly rushed development.
2. No Mouse or Light Gun Support - Again possibly due to rushed development. These features were often overlooked anyway.
3. Lesser Quality Audio - The ADPCM & AIF seem to have lost some quality compared to the PS1's XA. Sequenced Music also seems to be of lesser quality.
4. Lesser Sprite Animation - lacks some animation from the PS1 release and other versions. Some has been added however. Example: Metal's flashlight moves over to the secret stairwell in Queen Hospital in all other versions EXCEPT the Saturn version. Again, possibly due to rushed development, or was just overlooked.

More may be added to the list, but for now I'll leave it at that.
Time to vote!
~Jonathan
Last edited by GirianSeed573 on Sat Jul 13, 2013 1:34 am, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by zombie-flesheater »

I'd go with the lesser evil - the Saturn version. The censoring of the Playstation version is just way too intrusive and annoying. Showing it first and then blurring it doesn't really soften it down at all, it's just pulling you out of the game.
Anyways, my favourite version is and will always remain the Sega CD one... except for a well done remake, maybe...
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(PS1) Policenauts Private Collection
(PS1) Snatcher
(SAT) Snatcher
(SAT) Policenauts
(PS1) Metal Gear Solid (Digital, PSN)
(PS1) Metal Gear Solid: VR Missions
(GBC) Metal Gear Solid (cartridge-only)
(PS2) Zone of the Enders
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty
(PS2) The Document of Metal Gear Solid 2
(PS2) Zone of the Enders: The 2nd Runner
(GBA) boktai: The Sun is in Your Hand
(NGC) Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater
(PSP) Metal Gear AC!D (UMD-only)
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Digital Graphic Novel (Digital, PSN)
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops Plus
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid: The Essential Collection
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid 4: Database
(iOS) Metal Gear Solid: Touch
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection Limited Edition
(360) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection
(3DS) Metal Gear Solid: Snake Eater 3D
(PSV) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection
(PS3) Zone of the Enders HD Collection
(360) Zone of the Enders HD Collection Limited Edition
(PS3) Zone of the Enders HD Edition (JP, Digital, PSN)
(PS3) Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance Limited Edition
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid: The Legacy Collection (NA & JP)
(Win) Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes (NA & JP)
(360) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes (Digital, Xbox Live)
(Win) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain
(Win) Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by GirianSeed573 »

Yeah, I did kind of find it intrusive. I tried to make sense the Effect being applied later by thinking like a Konami Employee. It's more of a shock value thing. Think about how a Japanese audience would receive it, especially with CERO in place with its stricter censoring laws. Lets say a player (who isn't used to seeing thing like rotting skulls) sees that for a split second. That disturbing image would linger in their mind (which actually tends to tone fear down if its not seen for awhile). If seen again in the future, a similar shock could occur; As opposed to seeing it uncensored, which would settle in the minds of player becoming less scary and eventually would be unsettling. All of this probably seems preposterous to someone whose already seen the full gore. I'm not saying I'm right, or that Konami makes the best decisions. Its just some "food for thought". ;)

Being somewhat of an audio freak, I found the Sequenced music very unpleasant in the Saturn version when compared to the PS1's. Its freakin' awful! The quality and tone of the samples are all off. Konami really could have done a better job the the SS version, had the put some more time into it. The graphics don't look as smooth; some animation is missing, whereas some is added!; and the audio quality sucks. They could have done so much more if they took some time and didn't just port it. In fact, it seems like they did! I've already mentioned the animation, but some scenes were also redrawn or reshaded, but only some. This all leads me to believe that its been rushed. Like they were going to put some real effort to touch up some things, but Konami felt they could capitalize better if they shortened development times, thus effecting the quality of the final product. Its a shame really. And one more thing that leads me to this is (out of everything) the file system on the disc. Yes, the way the files are arranged. In the PS1 version, there are so many directories it'll make your head spin; and there all barely labeled with any sort of file name that you could determine what it is (example: C:\DES\CC3\CC3_B000.BIN) the SS version however is just a bunch of files sloppily laid out on the disc with very little arrangement. (Perhaps it's the difference in architecture, but it still could use some arranging.) :|
Last edited by GirianSeed573 on Sat Jul 13, 2013 1:37 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by zombie-flesheater »

GirianSeed573 wrote:Yeah, I did kind of find it intrusive. I tried to make sense the Effect being applied later by thinking like a Konami Employee. It's more of a shock value thing. Think about how a Japanese audience would recieve it, especially with CERO inplace with it's stricter censoring laws. Lets say a player (who isn't used to seeing thing like rotting skulls) sees that for a split second. That disturbing image would linger in their mind (which actually tends to tone fear down if its not seen for awhile). If seen again in the future, a similar shock could occur; As opposed to seeing it unsencored, which would settel in the minds of player becoming less scary and eventually would be unsettling. All of this probably seems proposterous to someone whose already seen the full gore. I'm not saying I'm right, or that Konami makes the best dicisions. Its just some "food for thought". ;)
I get your point. Meaning it's more scary when you don't see it. It works well with movies (sometimes). Especially the things you don't actually see at all have more impact than obvious gore scenes, since your mind makes up more horrible things than any director could ever be able to show.
BUT when actually missing content in a video game, i can't help but feel cheated.
Imagine a generic shooter (for example... you might of course also add action/adventure or whatever genre instead) where there is a story gap somewhere in between and the protagonist just tells somebody what he's been doing during that time. And maybe what he tells feels more interesting and exciting than anything else you already did actually play in the game. Games don't work that way. A game telling you about the cool stuff you're NOT able to play would be a real bummer.
In Snatcher's case, it's even worse: You actually get to see the footage and then it's censored afterwards. Like showing some candy to a kid and then eating the candy yourself instead in front of the kid's eyes. I can hardly imagine anybody at all thinking "Wow, cool effect, censoring the gore and all..." instead of "WTF...?!". Sure, one could argue that all screens are actually video feed from Metal Gear's camera being sent to you, the player, but then again it doesn't make any sense that you also see a) Metal Gear himself and b) scenes where Metal isn't even present at the time (like at the very beginning or during the end of the game).
It probably didn't even affect the rating in any way, since the actual content being shown has more impact on the classification as the duration of showing the same content itself. And especially as it's the case with Snatcher, the main reason for its classification would rather be its storyline and setting anyways.
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(SAT) Policenauts
(PS1) Metal Gear Solid (Digital, PSN)
(PS1) Metal Gear Solid: VR Missions
(GBC) Metal Gear Solid (cartridge-only)
(PS2) Zone of the Enders
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty
(PS2) The Document of Metal Gear Solid 2
(PS2) Zone of the Enders: The 2nd Runner
(GBA) boktai: The Sun is in Your Hand
(NGC) Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater
(PSP) Metal Gear AC!D (UMD-only)
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Digital Graphic Novel (Digital, PSN)
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops Plus
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid: The Essential Collection
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid 4: Database
(iOS) Metal Gear Solid: Touch
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection Limited Edition
(360) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection
(3DS) Metal Gear Solid: Snake Eater 3D
(PSV) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection
(PS3) Zone of the Enders HD Collection
(360) Zone of the Enders HD Collection Limited Edition
(PS3) Zone of the Enders HD Edition (JP, Digital, PSN)
(PS3) Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance Limited Edition
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid: The Legacy Collection (NA & JP)
(Win) Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes (NA & JP)
(360) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes (Digital, Xbox Live)
(Win) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by GirianSeed573 »

Sou desu nei...
Good response, and I see where you're coming from.
Dude, my mind can conger up some really freaking Scary things (which I can easily bear), but facing theme in person is a different story. Actually, I find the fear of something lurking around the corner a lot scarier than whats actually there. Perhaps that's why Resident Evil/Silent Hill scares me a lot during a first playthrough.
In Snatcher, this isn't even a good idea! A lot of the material isn't even that freaky. It IS like there cheating you, but for a first time player it wouldn't be so bad, as they have no opinion on to base what the standard is. A lot of people play the Sega CD version first, which is arguably one of the better versions. In doing this, they form a sort-of bond with the game. When most English-only speaking player play the Japanese versions, they don't necessarily appreciate the main thing the game is about, THE STORY. The only way to play is to just play off of memory. Without appreciation of the whole game, all that's left is to nitpick, especially with an adventure game like Snatcher! That's what I believe is the origin of the over-negativity towards these Versions. I mean, come on!, there not the horrible abominations some people claim them to be; And most people who do haven't even played them!

I swear, I looked all over the screenshots of the packaging and I couldn't find the CERO rating. Same with Policenauts.

Where did you get at that you view the game though Metal's recorded memory. I just thought it was some 3rd Person Omnicient POV. And if it was Metal's memory, would that make the player Benson Cunningham viewing it through the signal sent back the JUNKER HQ? No, It Wouldn't! ...Wait, the narrator is voiced by Ray Van Steen who also voiced Cunningham... (haha). Besides, hes not even a real person! And Snatchers wipe their memory upon destruction. I've even heard the self-destruct to prevent study of their endoskeleton.
Last edited by GirianSeed573 on Sat Jul 13, 2013 1:39 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by best name ever »

GirianSeed573 wrote:the SS version however is just a bunch of files sloppily layed out on the disc with very little arrangement. (Perhaps it's the differnce in architecture, but it still could use some arranging.) :|
All Saturn games are like this, same goes for Sega CD.
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(PS1) Policenauts
(PS1) Policenauts Private Collection
(PS1) Snatcher
(SAT) Snatcher
(SAT) Policenauts
(PS1) Metal Gear Solid (Digital, PSN)
(PS1) Metal Gear Solid: VR Missions
(GBC) Metal Gear Solid (cartridge-only)
(PS2) Zone of the Enders
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty
(PS2) The Document of Metal Gear Solid 2
(PS2) Zone of the Enders: The 2nd Runner
(GBA) boktai: The Sun is in Your Hand
(NGC) Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater
(PSP) Metal Gear AC!D (UMD-only)
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Digital Graphic Novel (Digital, PSN)
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops Plus
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid: The Essential Collection
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid 4: Database
(iOS) Metal Gear Solid: Touch
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection Limited Edition
(360) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection
(3DS) Metal Gear Solid: Snake Eater 3D
(PSV) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection
(PS3) Zone of the Enders HD Collection
(360) Zone of the Enders HD Collection Limited Edition
(PS3) Zone of the Enders HD Edition (JP, Digital, PSN)
(PS3) Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance Limited Edition
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid: The Legacy Collection (NA & JP)
(Win) Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes (NA & JP)
(360) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes (Digital, Xbox Live)
(Win) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain
(Win) Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by GirianSeed573 »

I know, but some games at least had a couple of directories like the Gradius Deluxe Pack or the Salamander Deluxe Pack Plus. Although the main boot data just had to be out in the open. Hell, even Policenauts had all of it's game data in file folders (C:\NAUTS\MOVIE\MV000001.MOV for example). I did know Sega CD games had to be like this, but Saturn games? Oh well, perhaps there's some other motive that I wouldn't understand because I wasn't on the Dev Team.

I'm surprised no-ones said anything about how bad the Saturn's music sounds (and no I'm not talking about the Elevator/Pan-Flute-esque sound). Its just plain horrible compared to the PS1's sequenced BGM. At least that actually sounded good. It's like the samples have to high a pitch or something.
Last edited by GirianSeed573 on Sat Jul 13, 2013 1:40 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by best name ever »

There's a allot weird stuff with the Saturn's architecture that doesn't make that much sense. If you want to figure it out for your self you could probably find the reason for it in the Saturn's Development Manual.
GirianSeed573 wrote:I'm suprised no-ones said anything about how bad the Saturns music sounds (and no I'm not talking about the Elevator/Pan-Flute esque sound). Its just plain horrible comared to the PS1's sequenced BGM. Atleast that actually sounded good. I't like the samples have to high a pitch or something.
I've never heard the music from the Saturn version nor have I really heard any complaints about it, is it really that noticeable?
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(PS1) Policenauts Private Collection
(PS1) Snatcher
(SAT) Snatcher
(SAT) Policenauts
(PS1) Metal Gear Solid (Digital, PSN)
(PS1) Metal Gear Solid: VR Missions
(GBC) Metal Gear Solid (cartridge-only)
(PS2) Zone of the Enders
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty
(PS2) The Document of Metal Gear Solid 2
(PS2) Zone of the Enders: The 2nd Runner
(GBA) boktai: The Sun is in Your Hand
(NGC) Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater
(PSP) Metal Gear AC!D (UMD-only)
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Digital Graphic Novel (Digital, PSN)
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops Plus
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid: The Essential Collection
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid 4: Database
(iOS) Metal Gear Solid: Touch
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection Limited Edition
(360) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection
(3DS) Metal Gear Solid: Snake Eater 3D
(PSV) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection
(PS3) Zone of the Enders HD Collection
(360) Zone of the Enders HD Collection Limited Edition
(PS3) Zone of the Enders HD Edition (JP, Digital, PSN)
(PS3) Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance Limited Edition
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid: The Legacy Collection (NA & JP)
(Win) Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes (NA & JP)
(360) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes (Digital, Xbox Live)
(Win) Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain
(Win) Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by GirianSeed573 »

Wow! Thank you very much for the Saturn Development Manual. It'll be very interesting to read (even if I don't need it). :P

As for the Saturn's music, yes it's that bad. If you've played both versions, I mean, the quality is fucking Terrible! The PlayStation version actually sounded good, despite that weird ass choice for instruments. Now compare it with the Saturn version; A lot of notes are too high in pitch and the tracks have practically NO reverb, and that coming from a track that should have A LOT of reverb. And no, its not an emulation side effect, It happens on a real Saturn!

LiquidPolicenaut has some videos on YouTube comparing both versions. Try to find the video of the "Snatch Process", now compare the different versions of "Restoration". You should also see out how weird the music from Act 3 sounds.

I know I sound like I'm ranting here... because I am! It shouldn't have been like this, especially with a Konami Sound Team behind it. A lot of sequenced music sounds good on the Saturn, Look at Saturn Bomberman or Radiant Silvergun! The bottom line is that I'm very disappointed with the Saturn version. That doesn't mean I don't like it, Its Snatcher!, but it could have been a lot better...

EDIT:
To be fair, I was kind of harsh. It doesn't really deserve all those insults. Its not that bad in its own right, but still of less quality that it could be when compared to the PlayStation release. Again, I guess I went a little overboard.
Last edited by GirianSeed573 on Sat Jul 13, 2013 1:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by LiquidPolicenaut »

The quality between the PSX and Saturn version is noticeable just as GirianSeed said. The notes are sometimes too high, the tempo a little off and, many times, it sounds more muffled than the PSX version. This is the exact OPPOSITE of what happened with Lunar 2: Eternal Blue for the PSX and Saturn. I just compiled a few more videos of differences in selected songs across all the platforms (which I'll be uploading to YouTube shortly) and, in those, you will be able to tell the differences between the PSX and Saturn versions more clearly...
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by best name ever »

Just saw those clips by liquidpolicenaut and the music does sound messed up, it sounds like the BGM is being played in fast forward.

Here are the examples for anyone else who hasn't seen them yet.

(Playstation)


(Saturn)
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(SAT) Policenauts
(PS1) Metal Gear Solid (Digital, PSN)
(PS1) Metal Gear Solid: VR Missions
(GBC) Metal Gear Solid (cartridge-only)
(PS2) Zone of the Enders
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty
(PS2) The Document of Metal Gear Solid 2
(PS2) Zone of the Enders: The 2nd Runner
(GBA) boktai: The Sun is in Your Hand
(NGC) Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater
(PSP) Metal Gear AC!D (UMD-only)
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid 3: Subsistence
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Digital Graphic Novel (Digital, PSN)
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Portable Ops Plus
(PS2) Metal Gear Solid: The Essential Collection
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid 4: Database
(iOS) Metal Gear Solid: Touch
(PSP) Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker
(PS3) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection Limited Edition
(360) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection
(3DS) Metal Gear Solid: Snake Eater 3D
(PSV) Metal Gear Solid HD Collection
(PS3) Zone of the Enders HD Collection
(360) Zone of the Enders HD Collection Limited Edition
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by GirianSeed573 »

Thanks for embedding those videos.
It's been a while since I've seen you around here LiquidPolicenaut, glad your still listening in. :)
Last edited by GirianSeed573 on Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:45 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by zombie-flesheater »

GirianSeed573 wrote:So desu nei...
Good response, and I see where youre comming from.
Dude, my mind can conger up some really freaking Scary things (which I can easily bear), but facing theme in person is a differnt story. Actually, I find the fear of something learking around the corner alot scarier than whats actually there. Perhaps thats why Resident Evil/Silent Hill scares me alot during a first playthrough.
In Snatcher, this isn't even a good idea! Alot of the material isn't even that freaky. It IS like there cheating you, but for a first time player it wouldnt be so bad; As they have no opinon on to base what the standard is. Alot of people play the Sega CD version first, which is arguably one of the better versions. In doing this, they form a sort-of bond with the game. When most English-only speaking player play the Japanese versions, they don't necesarily appriciate the main thing the game is about, THE STORY. The only way to play is to just play off of memory. Without appriciation of the whole game, all thats left is to nitpick, especially with an adventure game like Snatcher! Thats what I belive is the origin of the over-negativity towards these Versions. I mean, come on!, there not the horrble abominations some people claim them to be; And most people who do haven't even played them!

I swear, I looked all over the screenshots of the packaging and I couldn't find the CERO rating. Same with Policenauts.

Where did you get at that you view the game though Metal's recorded memory. I just thought it was some 3rd Person Omnicent POV. And if it was Metal's memory, would that make the player Benson Cunningham viewing it through the signal sent back the JUNKER HQ? No, It Wouldn't! ...Wait, the narrator is voiced by Ray Van Steen who also voiced Cunningham... (haha). Besides, hes not even a real person! And Snatchers wipe their memory upon destruction. I've even heard the self-destruct to prevent study of their endoskeleton.
I made up the part with the screen being Metal's memory feed, like as a way to pretend it's not censored but it's actually intended or has some purpose. Like something one can cheat himself into thinking, so the censorship isn't as annoying as it actually is :mrgreen:
And it's exactly this blurring i find really unfitting. It doesn't make sense within the context of the game "camera" and it also doesn't serve any other purpose than keeping information / content from you, the player.
Maybe I'm exaggerating, but it just feels *wrong*. Like in a Shooter, whenever you shoot somebody and you ought to see blood / gore, that part of the screen goes into blur vision.
The only exception i can think of is Kane & Lynch 2. You have this blurry thing right over headshot wounds and genitals BUT it makes sense in the context of the game, i. e. the whole game is presented as if it was video feed taken straight out of youtube etc. That's also the reason why i brought up one could imagine the actual scenes shown in this version of Snatcher are Metal's video feed or something. Ironically, the Japanese version of K&L2 doesn't have this kind of "censoring" (although some other things are now raelly censored in return, especially gameplay-wise) and especially the (now viewable) headshots look really tame compared to the pixelated mess where your mind makes it appear far worse.
Toning down the violent scenes wouldn't have been that bad in comparison, especially for players not familiar with the Sega CD version. Here, it just feels like "Now you can see me... now you can't."...
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by LiquidPolicenaut »

Ok, here is the first video of my comparisons of certain tracks in Snatcher. This is for the track "Pleasure of Tension" and you can clearly hear the differences between all versions even between the PSX and Saturn versions...



I now have a total of 14 comparison tracks now up on my YouTube page. Chem 'em out! :)
Last edited by LiquidPolicenaut on Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:44 am, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by GirianSeed573 »

Thanks Liquid. :)
Hate to break it to ya, but the PS1 & Sega Saturn version of "Junker HQ" is actually a remix of "Kasuga" from SD Snatcher.
I you follow it carefully, you can hear the same chord progeression, it's just slowed down a lot.

Oh and how did you get the Saturn's music? Did you just record it?
If you've got the whole OST would you mind sending it to me? No problem if you don't.

The PC-88 version of "Creeping Silence" you uploaded doesn't sound like what the actual PC-88 produces. Same with "Pleasure of Tension". I think it came from some game rip someone made awhile ago. That whole rip didn't even sound anything like what it's supposed to. I've only found it on one site, and that was FFShrine. But alas, I've never been able to set up an FFShrine account because I've never received the confirmation email. (I've set up 2 accounts but they both didn't work.)

Good upload, anyway. ;)
Last edited by GirianSeed573 on Sat Jul 13, 2013 1:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by LiquidPolicenaut »

I don't know. I listened to "Kasuga" from the SCC Memorial Disk and I'm just not hearing it. *shrugs*. I still labeled the PSX/Saturn versions as "Junker HQ" since that's exactly where it plays so I figured it was natural to do it lol.

As for the Saturn soundtrack, yes, I had to record it directly. After having a hell of a time just to upload the PSX version, I was defeated by the impenetrable codecs of the Saturn version lol.

As far as the PC-88 songs, I have that specific upload of the PC-88 soundtrack you speak of and, when I compared it with my video upload as well as an actual video playthrough of the game on a PC-88, they all sound similar to me...
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by GirianSeed573 »

It took me quite a while to figure out it was "Kasuga".
Again the tempo on the -Joint Disk- was alot faster than the PS/SS versions.
What I did was try to hum the melody in my head as the song played. Eventually I saw that it mached up with the original chord progression, albiet much slower.
To an extent you almost have to make it match, but its there. :)
The melody in the PS/SS versions is also divided between the main Instruments and the Bass, as opposed to just the main instruments in SD Snatcher.
The context in which the BGM is used also matches up with SD Snatcher. (Ie Junker HQ.)
Then again, I also got "Mysterious Clue" from SD Snatcher as the BGM when Randam shows up in the SCD/PS/SS versions aswell for the same reasons.

For the Sega Saturn's sound codec, as far as I can tell the BGM uses ADPCM samples stored as ".CAT" files. A while ago I was searching for a game rip of the Saturn version when I came across one of your posts on some forum. You titled it something like "Ripping Music from Saturn Games". Well as far as I know theres only one game set up like this with the .CAT files and thats Snatcher. These arent even security catalogue files. I think they stand for Compressed Audio and something else. Windows often mistakes file extensions for other types of files. A good exaple would be the PS2 port of Thunder Cross; they use .ADX (ADPCM). Windows mistakes them for Adobe Acrobat files due to the file association with Adobe Acrobat. (Yeah, try opening ADPCM in Adobe, just try it!) Back to Snatcher, those are only the samples though. You still need the sequence data. The PlayStation naturraly supports this, (.SEQ files) but the Saturn version is probably hidden in the game code or the Sound Driver. I'd take some serious hacking to crack that! :P

As for the PC-88 soundtrack, yes it does sound very differnt. It sounds like its coming from some bad emulation or a clone of the PC-88's soundchip. The Snatcher "Radio Play" has the original version of "Creeping Silence" & "Pleasure of Tension" and theres a big differnce. At least for an Audio Freak like me...
By the way could you send me a link to that rip, I'm interested in downloading it, but as I've mentioned FFShrine doesn't work for me.
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by LiquidPolicenaut »

After I posted my last message, I went back to the videos and heard the difference this time and I realized I used the wrong track for the videos. THOSE sound more like the PC-88 rip from FFShrine. I knew I had another version of the PC-88 soundtrack somewhere, so I looked for it, found it, and heard the difference between the two. I have now reuploaded the videos for "Creeping Silence" and "Pleasure of Tension" (and edited the above msg with the embedded YouTube video)...

Here is the link for the FFShrine PC-88 rip...
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=HVCRRTWP
Last edited by LiquidPolicenaut on Thu Sep 29, 2011 1:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by GirianSeed573 »

Thanks for the link, Liquid. :)
I've been looking for a way to get that for a while.
I'll have to check out your reuploads to.

I see the folder comes with some MDX X68000 MIDI files... This isn't even a rip then! Its just some MIDIs based off the PC-88's sound code. Its not even from a PC-88; it's from an X68000 witch uses a different ,yet similar, sound chip, the YM2151. I can't believe people mistook it for a PC-88 rip! Besides, its missing tracks. The Original Game had 45 Tracks counting the Unused BGM and Fanfares, this rip only has 27 Tracks.

Oh well... Interesting find nonetheless.
Last edited by GirianSeed573 on Sat Jul 13, 2013 1:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by AwesomeBrand »

I love those music comparisons. Due to my lack of Japanese prowess I can't play anything that isn't the Sega CD version. MAKE MOAR PLZ!?
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by LiquidPolicenaut »

GirianSeed573 wrote:Thanks for the link, Liquid. :)
I've been looking for a way to get that for a while.
I'll have to check out your reuploads to.

I see the folder comes with some MDX X68000 MIDI files...
This isnt even a rip then! Its just some MIDIs based off the PC-88's sound code.
Its not even from a PC-88; its from an X68000 whitch uses a differnt ,yet similar, sound chip, the YM2151.
I can't belive people mistook it for a PC-88 rip!
Besides, its missing tracks. The Original Game had 45 Tracks counting the Unused BGM and Fanfares, this rip only has 27 Tracks.
Oh well... Intersing find nonetheless.
Ah, I never knew that! I was comparing the rest of my PC-88 soundtrack that I have to the rip we are talking about and, wow, it really IS a big difference in sound quality! I checked my soundtrack, the "radio play" cd and this rip and it is indeed very noticeable. Also, as you said, this rip only has 27 and my other one has 37 so it's not even complete.

I guess that rip should be labeled "Snatcher PC-88 OST....X68 style!" lol :)
AwesomeBrand wrote:I love those music comparisons. Due to my lack of Japanese prowess I can't play anything that isn't the Sega CD version. MAKE MOAR PLZ!?
I got a few more coming up :)
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by GirianSeed573 »

LiquidPolicenaut wrote:I guess that rip should be labeled "Snatcher PC-88 OST....X68 style!"
Nice one Liquid!
I'm surprised you didn't say any thing about the Unused BGMs, since very few people know about them. There are 4 of them.
The first one resembles "Midnight Science".
The second one is a short jingle that uses the "Theme of Snatcher" motif.
The last 2 are variations of "Theme of Katharine", One of which was later reused for SD Snatcher as "Theme of Katherine #2".
AwesomeBrand wrote:I love those music comparisons. Due to my lack of Japanese prowess I can't play anything that isn't the Sega CD version.
Playing trough the Japanese versions isn't actually that hard, but I don't recommend it.
As I've said, you won't appreciate the story so all that'll be left is to nitpick, and you probably won't enjoy them as much as you would if you could actually understand it.
Besides, people usually become biased toward whatever version of the game they played first.
I liked the all versions, but then again I have very weird tastes... :P
If you decide to play them and truly need help with the games I recommend going to the "Policenauts Paradise & Snatcher Shrine" for import help.
Last edited by GirianSeed573 on Sat Jul 13, 2013 1:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by AwesomeBrand »

I went ahead and looked through the internet by copy pasting Snatcher in Japanese from the wikipedia page simply out of curiosity to see what I could find. During my expedition I found playthroughs of both the Saturn and PS1 versions of Snatcher! The player felt need to commentate on them, but they are otherwise complete playthroughs at first glance. I haven't watched them all extensively though so for all I know they might have skipped something somehow :/

Playstation
http://satocchi1982.ti-da.net/e2824121.html

Sega Saturn
http://nicoviewer.net/mylist/21609340

I also found a small bit of fan art
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by GirianSeed573 »

Nice fan art, where did you find it? :)
Last edited by GirianSeed573 on Fri Oct 07, 2011 4:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Kojima games owned: In order of how I originally played them...
Metal Gear Solid
MGS2 Substance
MGS3 Subsistence
Zone of the Enders: The Second Runner
MGS: Portable Ops
MGS: Peace Walker
MGS HD Collection
ZoE HD Collection
PSN: AwesomeBrand
Xbox Live: AwesomeBr0
Location: Outskirts of Neo Kobe
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Re: Comparisson Between PS1 and Saturn Versions

Post by AwesomeBrand »

I literally plopped スナッチャー into google images and scrolled down. There's alot of unrelated crap but that's where it was. The sites I got them from are, respectively...
http://magamyu.gozaru.jp/hanken02.htm
http://raikouweb.exblog.jp/8806456/
and a few others
http://dic.nicovideo.jp/b/a/%E3%82%B9%E ... 3%83%BC/1-
http://www.katch.ne.jp/~guts-2t86/gameg18.html
http://www.interq.or.jp/cool/mira/goods/goods04.html
and a cosplay
http://kero.dyndns.tv/hp/archives/120.html
"Games are a study about people." - Hideo Kojima 2004
"To fans and myself, games are a dream." - Keiji Inafune 2003
"Games are life itself." - Hiroyuki Kobayashi 2003
"Why're ya taking this game so seriously?" - Beat Takeshi 1986
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