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Posted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 3:42 pm
by Artemio

Posted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 5:09 pm
by Marc
Cool. :) I hope more sites pick the story up.

Posted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 6:33 am
by 87th
I'm not sure where the average gamer stands with MGS2, now. They keep going back and forth between calling it a classic and calling it overrated.

Posted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 8:15 pm
by hybridtheory
87th wrote:I'm not sure where the average gamer stands with MGS2, now. They keep going back and forth between calling it a classic and calling it overrated.

It is indeed a classic in my opinion. I've seen one overated game get too much praise it's Halo2, and that's getting more hear than SOL now I think.

Posted: Sat Aug 19, 2006 5:47 am
by 87th
Well, of course you are going to say its a classic: you are a Hideo Kojima fan. I'm wondering how it's remembered by gamers who don't have any bias towards his games.

Posted: Sat Aug 19, 2006 6:04 am
by Rick Deckard
I don't think it's ever been considered a classic by anybody other than yer average hardcore Kojima fan. I'm still something of a Hideo enthusiast although I've become increasingly disillusioned with his work recently, and I think MGS2 might have been the start of that. I do genuinely love the first chapter, though. It wasn't that I was no longer was playing as Snake, as is the usual reason most people put forward for others not liking it, I just think the Plant chapter is lacking in decent dialogue, story and characters. Overall I still think it's jolly good, but no classic.

Posted: Sat Aug 19, 2006 11:31 am
by ratperson665
I'm a fan of Kojima's older work (Snatcher, Metal Gear 1&2, Policenauts and MGS1.) Although I enjoyed “Sons Of Liberty” I think it's to kojima games what "The Big Fat Kill" is to the "Sin City" series of graphic novels, good but not the best.

Posted: Sat Aug 19, 2006 1:20 pm
by 87th
I didn't really think very highly of MGS2 when I first played it, as I had very high expectations after enjoying MGS so much. It did grow on me after a while though, and I've always felt that the Tanker was one of the best sections of any Kojima game.

Posted: Sat Aug 19, 2006 3:55 pm
by ratperson665
Call me crazy, but I liked Raiden.

Posted: Sat Aug 19, 2006 4:36 pm
by 87th
I wouldn't say I liked Raiden, but I didn't dislike him, either. I accepted him as the new playable character quickly.

Posted: Sat Aug 19, 2006 4:57 pm
by ratperson665
He just seemed to be more human and likable than Snake in my opinion. Snake is allot more fun to play as though.

Posted: Sat Aug 19, 2006 6:11 pm
by Marc
I remember reading in Japanese somewhere that Kojima thought MGS2 was the best in the series when he made it, but when he replayed it before MGS3 came out, all the unanswered questions it leaves bothered him.

Posted: Sat Aug 19, 2006 6:25 pm
by hybridtheory
87th wrote:Well, of course you are going to say its a classic: you are a Hideo Kojima fan. I'm wondering how it's remembered by gamers who don't have any bias towards his games.

Not really. You either hear Raiden's 'gay', too many cutscenes, and confusing (on purpose BTW) story.

Posted: Sun Aug 20, 2006 4:56 am
by Rick Deckard
Raiden's not a character, he's a tool for repeating the last word of every spoken sentence just in case you happened to miss it.

Posted: Sun Aug 20, 2006 5:24 am
by Spike
Rick Deckard wrote:Raiden's not a character, he's a tool for repeating the last word of every spoken sentence just in case you happened to miss it.
Solid Snake often does that, too (i.e. MGS1 Briefing).

Posted: Sun Aug 20, 2006 9:50 am
by Marc
Kojima has said he does that repeating on purpose (whenever it involves information you wouldn't hear in real life, such as technical information, or a name that, Japanese at least, aren't used to) in case a player doesn't catch it the first time.

Posted: Sun Aug 20, 2006 4:54 pm
by Rick Deckard
Spike wrote:Solid Snake often does that, too (i.e. MGS1 Briefing).
That's true, but Raiden is ridiculously prolific!
Osiris wrote:Kojima has said he does that repeating on purpose (whenever it involves information you wouldn't hear in real life, such as technical information, or a name that, Japanese at least, aren't used to) in case a player doesn't catch it the first time.
Surely that only applies if you've got the attention span of a goldfish? I noticed the repetition of the important information, and did appreciate it at the time, such as Snake overhearing the guards and repeating where it is the DARPA Chief's being held, but some of it - particularly with Raiden - was totally ridiculous and unnecessary and was among the most irritating dialogue I've ever come across. Sometimes he'd repeat the last word as a question, and the person he was talking to would re-affirm it again! It was virtually self-parodic. Check out the scene with the President for loads of examples of that.

Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 9:24 pm
by Marc
I don't know, I'm just telling you why he said they do it. An interesting note is that Blaustein made a change in MGS1 regarding this repeating - Snake's line, "Baker? The president of ArmsTech?" when he's speaking to the DARPA Chief, was changed from the Japanese version. In the Japanese version, Snake says, "Baker? Who's that?" (!)

By the way, regarding the topic of this thread, if anyone's wondering why I chose the phrase "grand game plan", it was to match the word choice found in the Chronicle section of The Document of MGS2. I'd originally used another phrase until I noticed it; I decided to change it so people would know it refers to the same document.

Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 8:51 am
by Johnny Undaunted
So are we gonna see the revised MGSDCD translations tonight?

Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:10 am
by Marc
Ramesh is still working on them. He's been a little busy lately, but they should be up soon. He was thinking of waiting until after the GC hype dies down so they'd get the attention they deserve.